Berkeley Parents Network Floors

Berkeley Parents Network Floors


We live in a loft/warehouse rental where the wood floors are a bit beat and splintery in places. I am pregnant with our first baby so I hadn’t given the floor much thought, but my mother seemed very concerned and wants to pay to have wall to wall carpet installed. My husband and I are not that into the idea of carpet because it is nasty on many levels, 1) formaldihyde, 2) it will get trashed and then have to go into a landfill (our dog likes to swim at the beach several times a week and despite rinsing off is still always a little sandy and wet) and 3) this is a rental. Anyone have a practical suggestion for a flooring alternative that would be not so toxic and hold up to a sandy wet dog and be nice for a crawling baby and not a fortune? We were in a similar situation with both our kids — a rental with old-ish wood floors. I shudder at the idea at covering them up with carpet! Here are some ideas -

- If your mother is willing to pay for carpet, might she be willing to pay to have the floors re-sealed instead? That would at least solve the splintering problem. If not, could you negotiate something with your landlord?

- Small inexpensive rugs from IKEA, etc. that you can put in high-traffic areas where the baby will play. (Wait until s/he is born so you know where those areas are!)

- Foam mats, again in places where the baby will play

- Keep the baby in pants and socks instead of shorts, and s/he won’t mind the hard floor. The splintering does seem to be a potential issue though, so consider the above-mentioned sealing or covering up with temporary mats/rugs. anon You might try FLOR. They are carpet tiles that are made in an environmentally friendly way — the company will even recycle your old carpet when you’re done. We have a cool modern looking area rug in our dining room made with a few different types of carpet tiles and wall to wall in our basement living room that we installed ourselves. The best part is when you have a spill you pull the tile up, wash it out in the sink and put it back down when it dries. The downside is that they are not very plush if you are looking for that. happy flor customer I am a long time green architect and a mother and have consequently thought a bit about flooring issues. I agree with all of your concerns about wall to wall carpet. I would also recommend against hard surface flooring—it is hard to get any that are completely free of toxic chemicals, glues or finishes and given your pregnancy I would take every step to avoid them right now.

I think your best bet would be to get an area rug that is either braided cotton or all-wool with a jute backing. For at least 6 months you can just plop your baby on the rug and she/he won’t stray. Hooked rugs have a fairly even surface and are good for floor games.

My daughter grew up on older wood floors, with area rugs. Neither she nor her friends (or us for that matter) ever got splinters from the floor. And I can think of a friend who’s house had some fairly bad patches of termite damaged wood—again no issues with splinters. Cate When our baby was on the way we got 2 large wool carpets with bound edges. Not cheap but they have lasted years very well, no outgassing and stain resistant. Since we rent they move with us. It’s nice to have a soft surface for crawling, pulling up, reading, etc. We got an underpad for one to make it even more soft. Kristine

Jan 2009

We have a small hallway area (maybe 9×9?) in the center of our home that sees a lot of foot traffic (the dining room, kitchen, two bedrooms and a bathroom all open onto this area). Currently it is carpeted and the carpet is in terrible shape. We would like to replace it with some other sort of wood or wood-like flooring and are looking for some recommendations. A few things to note:

1. This is a rental home, so it doesn’t have to be the BEST choice, just one that looks nice enough and is serviceable. For the same reason, cheaper options would be better.

2. Underneath the carpet is some sort of vinyl flooring. The owners thinks it is likely to be asbestos-backed, so we do NOT want to remove it and create a hazard. Rather, we want something that can just be installed on top of it. [The house is an old bungalow in Rockridge, so you’d think there would be hardwood underneath, but it really doesn’t look that way. plus there’s the asbestos issue anyway.]

3. We are thinking about some sort of hardwood or hardwood subsititute (laminate, pergo, etc.) but don’t know enough about it to choose what would work in this situation and be affordable.

4. We are not handy and so would likely need to pay for it to be installed (or have landlord pay).

Suggestions? Any idea of how much this would cost all told? Judiah

Oct 2008

I recently learned my kitchen floor (where my older child crawled and my younger child is about to start crawling) is made with asbestos. We’re deciding between just covering it with a new floor, like linoleum or glue-down cork tiles, and having it removed. We think there is a nice fir floor underneath and would love to have that refinished. Anyone deal with this? What did you do (cover it, remove it, or choose to live with it) and how happy are you with the outcome? want safe floors We removed our asbestos floor in our kitchen of our previous home while I was pregnant with our first child. We found a beautiful fir floor underneath that was easy to refinish. We did have to pay a hazardous materials fee for the floor to be removed. I don’t remember the cost (almost 9 years ago) but it could not have been too much as we did not have that much to spend. Good luck. Lisa My family has gone through asbestos removals. They are expensive and the best contractors get sloppy. If you have it removed hire another company to test the contractors work and don’t let the contractor arrange to have the air tested. Have the testing company use a process that tests specifically for asbestos particles and not general particles in the air, it is expensive but worth it. My personal opinion and the one of many physicians is to have the asbestos covered up. It is not hazardous unless pulled up. concerned parent Are you sure that there’s asbestos in the tiles? In most cases, it’s the glue where the asbestos resides, and since the glue is under the tiles instead of on them, they’re of no danger to you UNTIL you disturb it. IF this is the case, and you’re set on tearing it out, the demolition needs to be handled very carefully. Use an expert company like Synergy, and beware the contractor who poo-poohs the condition, lest he contaminate your house. Berkeley Choate We covered our asbestos-backed 1950s vinyl flooring up with bamboo, laid right over the top of it. You could do this with cork, linoleum, laminate, hardwood, etc.; I’ve known a number of people who handled it this way. The asbestos only becomes a problem when it starts flaking and gets into the air, so sealing it up with another floor covering is a good way to go. If you want it removed, it will cost quite a bit more. You will have to disclose that it’s under there whenever you sell the house, but otherwise I don’t think it’s a big deal to leave it, as scary as it seems when you first find out about it. Practical We had tested a cross-section of kitchen floor coverings in our 1910 house and were told that there was asbestos in one of the layers. I had read somewhere that the glue that is used to affix flooring can be dissolved with boiling water. As water will prevent flaking asbestos from becoming airborne, we put on high construction boots (from Ashby) and rubber gloves, borrowed a linoleum scraper from the tool lending library, got out all our large pots and filled them with water, boiled and poured it on the floor in sections, then scraped it up! What a mess. Took about a half day to complete. A large string mop and squeezer mob bucket completed our set of tools. Bagged it all (put a heavy duty trash bag in the backyard) and discarded it as hazardous waste. We have an unfinished basement so the water did drip down a bit but most we mopped up before it seeped through. Not too difficult and the price was right. We then sanded and varathaned the fir floors underneath. Spectacular difference! Kathy We had a new kitchen floored installed. The old floor had asbestos in it (I cut off a small piece and had it tested by a Berkeley lab). We hired an asbestos abatement firm to do the removal, and we’re glad we didn’t trust the job to the flooring contractor. Obviously, we paid extra but came away with peace of mind. Anon asbestos tile is not super dangerous because it’s comprised— but when you pry it up, be sure to keep things damp to avoid friable particulate matter from getting into the air. Lem [Editor] see also: Advice about Asbestos

Feb 2008

I live in a one-story Berkeley bungalow with a 4 ft. crawlspace beneath and wood floors — in some rooms, the original douglas fir subfloor is the main floor — and our floors are ice cold. Radiant heat is out of the question financially, but I’ve heard suggestions of either putting spray or traditional insulation under the house to help keep the floors warmer. Are there other suggestions out there that people have tried (and worked)? Slippers and area rugs help, but maybe there’s another way to better insulate the floor, period? Thanks! Cold Feet It sounds like you need to insulate your floors! I had the floors insulated in my 1920s house and didn’t mention it to my tenant. My tenant called me that night to thank me for making the house so much more comfortable.

In the last year I have worked with All Seasons Insulation and McHales. I recommend you call All Seasons at 800 905 7965 to get your floor joists insulated ASAP.

Regarding radiant floors, a radiant heating system does not need to cost an arm and a leg if kept simple. If you were really interested in keeping your toes toasty warm that would be the way to go. George Dear Ice cold feet: you (or i) can install traditional insulation between the floor joists. It is a dirty job but it can most likely be done in a day. I did this in my house in Massachusetts and it worked very well. -Oren I installed R19 under my wood floors, this helped slightly but the floors were still cold. Radiant heat made a huge difference. If you are handy it’s inexpensive to install in homes with crawlspaces. I spent about $1600-$2000 in parts cost and a lot of my own labor but it was worth it. Berkeley has mild winters, your water heater and a single pump are plenty to heat a small house. This is called an »open system.» You need to plumb it so a shower flushes cold water through the floor keeping the system fresh. There are at least two websites that sell packages that cut down on the amount of plumbing you need to do, I bought some parts from them, some from ebay, easier to just get it all from one place. Search for »radiant heat» on google and look for the two stores that provide both prices and info (diagrams etc. )

What’s required: Skills: Copper sweating, Basic wiring, Ability to bend pex tubing without kinking it (takes practice)

You could start with one room for about $800 in parts and add a room at a time for roughly $300 in parts. Big cost is labor, it is at least a week of work to get one room up and working for someone inexperienced. Alex

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